The Insurrection Investigation just keeps getting better

[merh]

[merh]

Dec 22, 2021 23:44:58 GMT abbey1227 said:

Dec 22, 2021 12:17:17 GMT merh said:

If you watch those Discovery ID murder shows,.you would know a lot of stuff gets held until after the case is decided in court. Some of it being stuff only the perpetrator would know. 

Yet you have decided the FBI did it.

All this info about people on Trump's side raising money, trying to change the election to the way they believe it should have gone.

Like those Wisconsin electors who faked paperwork to try to cast their votes for Trump. No conflict of interest that one of them is on the board of electors deciding whether or not to prosecute himself.

The way all the fraud being found seems to be Republicans casting extra votes for Donald?

OR.......... a lot of people doing the same things people associated with Al Gore did before in trying to legally challenge the results.

Again, the very same FBI that admitted Hillary broke the law, yet never bothered charging her with a thing. They pick and choose.

GORE STOPPED AT A CERTAIN POINT.
ADMITTED DEFEAT.

When has Trump done this?

The Florida election was closely scrutinized after Election Day. Due to the narrow margin of the original vote count, Florida Election Code 102.141 mandated a statewide machine recount, which began the day after the election. It was ostensibly completed on November 10 in the 66 Florida counties that used vote-counting machines and reduced Bush's lead to 327 votes.According to legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin, later analysis showed that a total of 18 counties—accounting for a quarter of all votes cast in Florida—did not carry out the legally mandated machine recount, but "No one from the Gore campaign ever challenged this view" that the machine recount had been completed.

Once the closeness of the election in Florida was clear, both the Bush and Gore campaigns organized themselves for the ensuing legal process. On November 9, the Bush campaign announced they had hired George H. W. Bush's former Secretary of State James Baker and Republican political consultant Roger Stone to oversee their legal team, and the Gore campaign hired Bill Clinton's former Secretary of State Warren Christopher.

Following the machine recount, the Gore campaign requested a manual recount in four counties. Florida state law at the time allowed a candidate to request a manual recount by protesting the results of at least three precincts. The county canvassing board was then to decide whether to do a recount, as well as the method of the recount, in those three precincts. If the board discovered an error that in its judgment could affect the outcome of the election, they were then authorized to do a full recount of the ballots. This statutory process primarily accommodated recounts for local elections. The Gore campaign requested that disputed ballots in Miami-Dade, Broward, Palm Beach and Volusia Counties be counted by hand. Volusia County started its recount on November 12. Florida statutes also required that all counties certify and report their returns, including any recounts, by 5:00 p.m. on November 14. The manual recounts were time-consuming, and it soon became clear that some counties would not complete their recounts before the deadline. On November 13 the Gore campaign and Volusia and Palm Beach Counties sued to have the deadlines extended.

Meanwhile, the Bush campaign worked to stop the recount. On November 11, it joined a group of Florida voters in suing in federal district court for a preemptive injunction to stop all manual recounting of votes in Florida. Bush's lawyers argued that recounting votes in just four counties violated the 14th Amendment and also that similarly punched ballots could be tabulated differently since Florida had no detailed statutory standards for hand-counting votes. On November 13, the federal court ruled against an injunction.

On November 14, the original deadline for reporting results, with the Volusia County recount complete, Bush held a 300-vote lead. The same day, a state judge upheld that deadline but ruled that further recounts could be considered later. Florida's secretary of state, Katherine Harris, a Republican, then gave counties until 2:00 p.m. on November 15 to provide reasons for recounting their ballots. The next day, the Florida Supreme Court allowed manual recounts in Palm Beach and Broward Counties to continue but left it to a state judge to decide whether Harris must include those votes in the final tally. Miami-Dade County decided on November 17 to conduct a recount but suspended it on November 22. The Gore campaign sued to force Miami-Dade County to continue its recount, but the Florida Supreme Court refused to consider the request.

As the manual recounts continued, the battle to certify the results intensified. On November 17, Judge Terry Lewis of Leon County Circuit Court permitted Harris to certify the election results without the manual recounts, but on the same day the Florida Supreme Court stayed that decision until it could consider an appeal by Gore. On November 21, the Florida Supreme Court ruled unanimously that manual counts in Broward, Palm Beach and Miami-Dade Counties must be included and set 5:00 p.m. on November 26 as the earliest time for certification. After that decision, the Bush campaign appealed to the U.S. Supreme Court, arguing that the state court effectively rewrote state election statutes after the vote.

As the manual recounts progressed, most of Florida's counties were considering overseas absentee ballots. That part of the vote count was completed on November 18, increasing Bush's lead to 930 votes. The Palm Beach County recount and the Miami-Dade County recount (having been suspended) were still incomplete at 5:00 p.m. on November 26, when Harris certified the statewide vote count with Bush ahead by 537 votes. The next day, Gore sued under Florida's statutory construct of the "contest phase". On November 28, Judge N. Sanders Sauls of Leon County Circuit Court rejected Gore's request to include the recount results from Miami-Dade and Palm Beach Counties. Gore appealed that decision to the Florida Supreme Court. Sauls also rejected Gore's contest of the election result on December 4, and Gore appealed that decision too. On December 8, the Florida justices, by a 4–3 vote, rejected the selective use of manual recounts in just four counties and ordered immediate manual recounts of all ballots in the state where no vote for president had been machine-recorded, also known as undervotes.

The U.S. Supreme Court convened on December 1 to consider Bush's appeal. On December 4, the Court ordered the Florida Supreme Court to clarify its ruling that had extended the certification date. On December 9, the Court suspended the manual recount, in progress for only several hours, on the grounds that irreparable harm could befall Bush, according to a concurring opinion by Justice Antonin Scalia.

Meanwhile, on December 6 the Republican-controlled Florida legislature convened a special session to appoint a slate of electors pledged to Bush, as the U.S. Constitution bestows upon state legislatures the duty to determine how its state's electors are appointed. On December 12, the same day as the U.S. Supreme Court ruling, the Florida House approved awarding the state's electoral votes to Bush, but the matter was moot after the Court's ruling. Some have argued that awarding the electors in this manner would be illegal.

On December 13, Gore conceded the election to Bush in a nationally televised address.

Over & done.
None of this endless audits.

[abbey1227]

Dec 24, 2021 0:45:57 GMT merh said:

Dec 22, 2021 23:44:58 GMT abbey1227 said:

GORE STOPPED AT A CERTAIN POINT.
ADMITTED DEFEAT.

When has Trump done this?

On December 13, Gore conceded the election to Bush in a nationally televised address.

Over & done.
None of this endless audits.

Trump left the White House.......and his direct legal challenges were over long before December 13 of that year.

Unless you're talking about speeches? Cuz you're not seriously going to claim that Gore and Hillary haven't STILL been whining about losing elections unfairly?

[merh]

Dec 24, 2021 2:18:38 GMT abbey1227 said:

Dec 24, 2021 0:45:57 GMT merh said:

GORE STOPPED AT A CERTAIN POINT.
ADMITTED DEFEAT.

When has Trump done this?


Over & done.
None of this endless audits.

Trump left the White House.......and his direct legal challenges were over long before December 13 of that year.

Unless you're talking about speeches? Cuz you're not seriously going to claim that Gore and Hillary haven't STILL been whining about losing elections unfairly?

The recounts in different states like your own didn't continue? Are some still continuing?

Trunp was president until January 2021.
What do you mean he abandoned the challenges.

What the fuck is Q about?
All these guys like Jim Jordan who won't say Biden is the legitimate president?

Watch now: Arizona Senate presents 2020 election recount results
Sep 24, 2021 Updated Oct 9, 2021

I believe September 24, 2021 is a good 9 months after December 13, 2020

Do you just tune out all the news you don't agree with or just forget it?

/republicans-resist-saying-3-simple-210101171.html

Republicans resist saying 3 simple words: 'Joe Biden won'
THOMAS BEAUMONT
Fri, December 17, 2021, 

They are just three little words, but they have become nearly impossible for many Republicans to say: “Joe Biden won."

Eleven months after the Democrat’s inauguration, Republican lawmakers and candidates across the country are squirming and stumbling rather than acknowledging the fact of Biden's victory in the 2020 presidential election. In debates and interviews, they offer circular statements or vague answers when asked whether they believe Biden won.

Yes or no?

In Minnesota this week, five GOP candidates for governor came up with 1,400 other words when asked by conservative radio host Hugh Hewitt for an answer.

On NBC's “Meet the Press” on Sunday, GOP Sen. Roger Marshall of Kansas would only concede: “Joe Biden was sworn into office.”

The hazy statements are one measure of election denialism within the Republican Party. Former President Donald Trump's lies about a stolen election have so taken hold among GOP voters that many of the party's candidates either believe them or fear the political repercussions of refuting Trump. That sets up a surreal dynamic for next year's elections, where the toughest question posed to GOP candidates — particularly in primaries — may be one with a one-word answer that they're reluctant to give.

Biden received more than 81 million votes to Trump’s 74 million, according to the tally of the Federal Election Commission. The tightest margin was in Arizona, where Biden won by 10,457 votes. More important, he won 306 votes in the Electoral College, more than the 270 required to become president. Trump got 232.

Even a GOP-led “audit” of votes in Arizona’s largest county came up with a Biden win. Dozens of state and federal courts, as well as the Trump administration's Justice Department, have dismissed claims of widespread voter fraud.

When The Associated Press set out to count every fraud claim in the states disputed by Trump, it found fewer than 475 potential cases — 15 hundredths of 1% of Biden's winning margin in those states.

And yet, many Republican candidates may be eying another number: A July Associated Press-NORC Poll found 66% of Republicans said Biden was not legitimately elected president. More than two-thirds of Americans overall said Biden was legitimately elected.

The doubt has been fueled by Trump, who has argued without evidence that the election was “rigged" and has urged his supporters to reject the outcome. He's set out to oust fellow Republicans who voted to certify the results.

Kansas' Marshall was among five senators who voted against certifying the electoral votes for Arizona and Pennsylvania in January, the day a mob of Trump supporters stormed the U.S. Capitol in a violent effort to prevent the final step that sealed Biden's win.

While Marshall hangs his answer on process, other Republicans go further. Arizona Republican Rep. Andy Biggs, who was part of a group of GOP congressmen who pushed false claims, recently answered a question from a colleague about who won by saying flatly, "We don't know.”

“There’s the problem,” Rep. Jamie Raskin, a Maryland Democrat, replied at a hearing of the House Oversight Committee. “Donald Trump refused to accept the results, and unfortunately we have one of the world’s great political parties which has followed him off of the ledge of this electoral lunacy, and it’s dangerous for democracy.”

There are some Republicans who clearly, without squirming, acknowledge Biden’s win. Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell is among them, along with Utah Sen. Mitt Romney, who was the GOP's 2012 presidential nominee, and Nebraska Sen. Ben Sasse, for instance. Republican National Committee chairwoman Ronna McDaniel uttered the words last month.

“Painfully, Joe Biden won the election, and it’s very painful to watch. He’s the president. We know that,” McDaniel told Washington reporters at a breakfast hosted by The Christian Science Monitor.

But it's clear not all Republicans know. In October, the second-ranking House Republican, Steve Scalise of Louisiana, repeatedly stopped short of disavowing Trump’s claims of fraud, asserting without evidence that “a number” of states “didn't follow” their election laws.

On Friday, Josh Mandel, a GOP candidate for Senate in Ohio, called for more investigations into the vote in battleground states. “I think Trump won,” he said in an interview on Hewitt's radio show.

“It is an important question and needs to be framed, I think, as I did. I expect it will be often asked and answered (or not) of many candidates in the year ahead,” Hewitt tweeted after the Minnesota debate.

The answers demonstrate the pressure for Republican primary candidates to appeal to, or at least not offend, the vocal Trump wing of the party, strategists say.

“In today’s grim Republican Party, the was-the-election-legit question has become a litmus test for whether you are truly loyal to the Republican Trumpist tribe or not,” said Mike Murphy, a veteran Republican strategist and Trump critic.

It took a while — that is, winning the Republican nomination for Virginia governor — for Glenn Youngkin to get there. In May, he said in an interview, “I mean, the reality is, and I have said this before, Joe Biden was legitimately elected our president."

But in February, though he stopped short of saying Biden “stole" the election, he was equally hesitant to declare Biden had been “legitimately elected," according to the nonpartisan political watchdog group Politifact.

Other candidates have moved in the other direction — away from the facts. In Ohio, where Republicans are vying for the nomination for an open Senate seat, candidate Bernie Moreno began airing an ad this week where he is quoted as saying, “President Trump says the election was stolen, and he’s right.”

Yet, just days after the election last year, Moreno urged conservatives on Twitter to “accept the results of the 140+ million votes cast,” and tweeted a congratulatory note to Biden for a “hard fought victory.”

On Wednesday, the discomfort for Republicans played out in full view from the debate stage in suburban Minneapolis.

One-by-one, five Minnesota Republicans running for governor talked around Hewitt's question: “Did President Biden win a constitutional majority in the Electoral College."

State Sen. Michelle Benson spilled 240 words recruiting Republican poll-watchers and blasting Minnesota's Democratic secretary of state before Hewitt bluntly asked again: “Did President Biden win?”

Her answer: “He was certified by Congress as having won the Electoral College."

Jim Jordan Snaps and Starts Yelling When Committee Chair Asks Him to Say That Biden Won the Election
BY JASON MICIAK
OCTOBER 20, 2021

Why is it so hard to just say Joe won?

www.donaldjtrump.com/news/news-7sdb8vwjbv0

Statement by Donald J. Trump, 45th President of the United States of America
12/23/21

Has it been at all noticed that I offered to debate anybody, on television or otherwise, about the RIGGED Presidential Election of 2020. This was a publicly stated challenge—I have been called a “ratings machine,” and therefore would be good for television economics—which have not been doing so well lately. With all the bravado out there, I have not had one credible person willing to stand up and debate me in order to defend the CROOKED election. All involved, like those on the Unselect Committee of January 6th, know that it is a losing proposition for them. The election numbers are not defensible. Arizona, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Georgia, Nevada, and probably New Hampshire, Minnesota, New Mexico, and others were all won, and in some cases big, by a certain Republican Presidential Candidate, me. So, after one month, a very public offer to debate, I have no takers—not even the sleazebags you see on the January 6th Commission who speak with such fake reverence about the day. This is Cancel Culture. They think they got away with the Crime of the Century, and they don’t want it to be talked about or discussed. Look at what has happened to our Country, and what a shame it is!

[merh]

The two Georgia election workers already filed a lawsuit against The Gateway Pundit earlier this month.


ATLANTA (AP) — Two Georgia election workers filed a lawsuit Thursday accusing a right-wing cable news channel and former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani of defaming them by falsely claiming they engaged in ballot fraud during the 2020 election.

It was the second defamation lawsuit by Fulton County election workers Ruby Freeman and Wandrea “Shaye” Moss this month over debunked claims they introduced suitcases of illegal ballots and committed other acts of election fraud to try to alter the outcome of the presidential election in Georgia. The pair, a mother and daughter, sued conservative website The Gateway Pundit on Dec. 2.

The lawsuit filed Thursday says One America News Network continued to accuse Freeman and Moss of wrongdoing even after Georgia election officials refuted the allegations against them. Giuliani, a lawyer for former President Donald Trump, appeared frequently on the network and along with OAN, “continued to publish and amplify the lie,” according to the suit filed in federal court in Washington.

An email to One America News Network and a member of the family that started it was not immediately returned. Messages at a phone number and email addresses associated with Giuliani were also not immediately returned.

Angered by his narrow loss in a traditionally Republican state, former President Donald Trump focused intense scrutiny on Georgia, making unproven claims that widespread fraud led to Joe Biden's victory in the state.

In a phone call with Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger on Jan. 2, Trump pressed the Republican official to “find” votes for him and mentioned Freeman by name, calling her “a vote scammer, a professional vote scammer and hustler.”

Freeman worked as a temporary election worker during the 2020 election, verifying signatures on absentee ballots and preparing them to be counted and processed. Moss has worked for the Fulton County elections department since 2012 and supervised the absentee ballot operation during last year’s election.

The suit says Freeman and Moss received “an immediate onslaught of violent and racist threats and harassment” as a result of the false claims against them and are “afraid to live normal lives.” It seeks punitive damages as well as a court order requiring the defendants to remove false statements about Freeman and Moss from their websites and other media channels.

www.yahoo.com/news/georgia-election-workers-file-second-224437244.html

[merh]

.adn.com/nation-world/2021/12/23/trumps-newest-business-partner-a-chinese-firm-with-a-history-of-securities-investigations/

Trump’s newest business partner: a Chinese firm with a history of securities investigations
By Douglas MacMillan and Jonathan O'Connell, The Washington Post
Updated: 22 hours ago Published: 22 hours ago


A Chinese firm helping former president Donald Trump take his new media company public has been the target of investigations by federal securities regulators, who say the firm misrepresented shell companies with no products and few employees as ambitious, growing enterprises, documents and interviews show.

Arc Capital, an investment advisory firm based in Shanghai, has repeatedly helped create or finance companies with little or no revenue, no customers and office locations that point to P.O. boxes, according to a Washington Post review of regulatory and court filings. One claimed to be developing autonomous drone software despite having no employees; another said it operated a publicly traded in-home bakery “specializing in freshly-made cakes and cupcakes” before saying it pivoted into touch-screen technologies for a “diversified blue-chip client base,” regulatory filings show.

The United States allows shell companies to be listed on public markets but requires operators to truthfully represent them as businesses with no active operations, securities lawyers said. The U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission has accused Arc of deceiving investors about the scope of its operations, the locations of the businesses and the identities of the people behind them, documents show.

This year, Arc helped create Digital World Acquisition, an investment vehicle that has raised over $1.2 billion to conduct a merger with Trump Media and Technology Group. Digital World is what’s known as a special purpose acquisition company, or SPAC, a type of shell business that raises money from investors to acquire a private start-up with strong growth prospects. The deal, which still must be approved by shareholders and regulators, has the potential to enrich the former president and turn his nascent social media start-up into a public company overnight.

The Trump name has attracted investors, pushing shares of Digital World up five times their listing price in anticipation of the merger, despite a lack of information about the actual business. Trump Media has released two slide presentations as part of its proposal, but the material offers scant detail about company’s proposed management team, corporate structure, finances or other information typically used by investors to judge a business’s viability.

“There’s a shell company basically merging with another shell company, because, as far as we know, the Trump media company hasn’t yet been formed,” said Robert B. Lamm, a lawyer who chairs the securities practice at Florida-based law firm Gunster.

Representatives from Arc Capital, Trump Media and Digital World did not respond to multiple requests for comment. In a promotional video last year, Arc managing partner Sergio Camarero cited SPACs as one of the business opportunities Arc was pursuing, along with helping Chinese state-owned companies identify infrastructure investment projects overseas.

CHINA!!!!!!!

[abbey1227]

Dec 24, 2021 16:46:56 GMT merh said:

Dec 24, 2021 2:18:38 GMT abbey1227 said:

Trump left the White House.......and his direct legal challenges were over long before December 13 of that year.

Unless you're talking about speeches? Cuz you're not seriously going to claim that Gore and Hillary haven't STILL been whining about losing elections unfairly?

The recounts in different states like your own didn't continue? Are some still continuing?

Trunp was president until January 2021.
What do you mean he abandoned the challenges.

What the fuck is Q about?
All these guys like Jim Jordan who won't say Biden is the legitimate president?

Watch now: Arizona Senate presents 2020 election recount results
Sep 24, 2021 Updated Oct 9, 2021

I believe September 24, 2021 is a good 9 months after December 13, 2020

Do you just tune out all the news you don't agree with or just forget it?

/republicans-resist-saying-3-simple-210101171.html

Republicans resist saying 3 simple words: 'Joe Biden won'
THOMAS BEAUMONT
Fri, December 17, 2021, 

They are just three little words, but they have become nearly impossible for many Republicans to say: “Joe Biden won."

Eleven months after the Democrat’s inauguration, Republican lawmakers and candidates across the country are squirming and stumbling rather than acknowledging the fact of Biden's victory in the 2020 presidential election. In debates and interviews, they offer circular statements or vague answers when asked whether they believe Biden won.

Yes or no?

In Minnesota this week, five GOP candidates for governor came up with 1,400 other words when asked by conservative radio host Hugh Hewitt for an answer.

On NBC's “Meet the Press” on Sunday, GOP Sen. Roger Marshall of Kansas would only concede: “Joe Biden was sworn into office.”

The hazy statements are one measure of election denialism within the Republican Party. Former President Donald Trump's lies about a stolen election have so taken hold among GOP voters that many of the party's candidates either believe them or fear the political repercussions of refuting Trump. That sets up a surreal dynamic for next year's elections, where the toughest question posed to GOP candidates — particularly in primaries — may be one with a one-word answer that they're reluctant to give.

Biden received more than 81 million votes to Trump’s 74 million, according to the tally of the Federal Election Commission. The tightest margin was in Arizona, where Biden won by 10,457 votes. More important, he won 306 votes in the Electoral College, more than the 270 required to become president. Trump got 232.

Even a GOP-led “audit” of votes in Arizona’s largest county came up with a Biden win. Dozens of state and federal courts, as well as the Trump administration's Justice Department, have dismissed claims of widespread voter fraud.

When The Associated Press set out to count every fraud claim in the states disputed by Trump, it found fewer than 475 potential cases — 15 hundredths of 1% of Biden's winning margin in those states.

And yet, many Republican candidates may be eying another number: A July Associated Press-NORC Poll found 66% of Republicans said Biden was not legitimately elected president. More than two-thirds of Americans overall said Biden was legitimately elected.

The doubt has been fueled by Trump, who has argued without evidence that the election was “rigged" and has urged his supporters to reject the outcome. He's set out to oust fellow Republicans who voted to certify the results.

Kansas' Marshall was among five senators who voted against certifying the electoral votes for Arizona and Pennsylvania in January, the day a mob of Trump supporters stormed the U.S. Capitol in a violent effort to prevent the final step that sealed Biden's win.

While Marshall hangs his answer on process, other Republicans go further. Arizona Republican Rep. Andy Biggs, who was part of a group of GOP congressmen who pushed false claims, recently answered a question from a colleague about who won by saying flatly, "We don't know.”

“There’s the problem,” Rep. Jamie Raskin, a Maryland Democrat, replied at a hearing of the House Oversight Committee. “Donald Trump refused to accept the results, and unfortunately we have one of the world’s great political parties which has followed him off of the ledge of this electoral lunacy, and it’s dangerous for democracy.”

There are some Republicans who clearly, without squirming, acknowledge Biden’s win. Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell is among them, along with Utah Sen. Mitt Romney, who was the GOP's 2012 presidential nominee, and Nebraska Sen. Ben Sasse, for instance. Republican National Committee chairwoman Ronna McDaniel uttered the words last month.

“Painfully, Joe Biden won the election, and it’s very painful to watch. He’s the president. We know that,” McDaniel told Washington reporters at a breakfast hosted by The Christian Science Monitor.

But it's clear not all Republicans know. In October, the second-ranking House Republican, Steve Scalise of Louisiana, repeatedly stopped short of disavowing Trump’s claims of fraud, asserting without evidence that “a number” of states “didn't follow” their election laws.

On Friday, Josh Mandel, a GOP candidate for Senate in Ohio, called for more investigations into the vote in battleground states. “I think Trump won,” he said in an interview on Hewitt's radio show.

“It is an important question and needs to be framed, I think, as I did. I expect it will be often asked and answered (or not) of many candidates in the year ahead,” Hewitt tweeted after the Minnesota debate.

The answers demonstrate the pressure for Republican primary candidates to appeal to, or at least not offend, the vocal Trump wing of the party, strategists say.

“In today’s grim Republican Party, the was-the-election-legit question has become a litmus test for whether you are truly loyal to the Republican Trumpist tribe or not,” said Mike Murphy, a veteran Republican strategist and Trump critic.

It took a while — that is, winning the Republican nomination for Virginia governor — for Glenn Youngkin to get there. In May, he said in an interview, “I mean, the reality is, and I have said this before, Joe Biden was legitimately elected our president."

But in February, though he stopped short of saying Biden “stole" the election, he was equally hesitant to declare Biden had been “legitimately elected," according to the nonpartisan political watchdog group Politifact.

Other candidates have moved in the other direction — away from the facts. In Ohio, where Republicans are vying for the nomination for an open Senate seat, candidate Bernie Moreno began airing an ad this week where he is quoted as saying, “President Trump says the election was stolen, and he’s right.”

Yet, just days after the election last year, Moreno urged conservatives on Twitter to “accept the results of the 140+ million votes cast,” and tweeted a congratulatory note to Biden for a “hard fought victory.”

On Wednesday, the discomfort for Republicans played out in full view from the debate stage in suburban Minneapolis.

One-by-one, five Minnesota Republicans running for governor talked around Hewitt's question: “Did President Biden win a constitutional majority in the Electoral College."

State Sen. Michelle Benson spilled 240 words recruiting Republican poll-watchers and blasting Minnesota's Democratic secretary of state before Hewitt bluntly asked again: “Did President Biden win?”

Her answer: “He was certified by Congress as having won the Electoral College."

Jim Jordan Snaps and Starts Yelling When Committee Chair Asks Him to Say That Biden Won the Election
BY JASON MICIAK
OCTOBER 20, 2021

Why is it so hard to just say Joe won?

www.donaldjtrump.com/news/news-7sdb8vwjbv0

Statement by Donald J. Trump, 45th President of the United States of America
12/23/21

Has it been at all noticed that I offered to debate anybody, on television or otherwise, about the RIGGED Presidential Election of 2020. This was a publicly stated challenge—I have been called a “ratings machine,” and therefore would be good for television economics—which have not been doing so well lately. With all the bravado out there, I have not had one credible person willing to stand up and debate me in order to defend the CROOKED election. All involved, like those on the Unselect Committee of January 6th, know that it is a losing proposition for them. The election numbers are not defensible. Arizona, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Georgia, Nevada, and probably New Hampshire, Minnesota, New Mexico, and others were all won, and in some cases big, by a certain Republican Presidential Candidate, me. So, after one month, a very public offer to debate, I have no takers—not even the sleazebags you see on the January 6th Commission who speak with such fake reverence about the day. This is Cancel Culture. They think they got away with the Crime of the Century, and they don’t want it to be talked about or discussed. Look at what has happened to our Country, and what a shame it is!

You really got no leg to stand on after the total ruckus put on by your pals since 2016..........that bar just keeps getting lowered.

[merh]

Dec 24, 2021 23:21:27 GMT abbey1227 said:

Dec 24, 2021 16:46:56 GMT merh said:

The recounts in different states like your own didn't continue? Are some still continuing?

Trunp was president until January 2021.
What do you mean he abandoned the challenges.

What the fuck is Q about?
All these guys like Jim Jordan who won't say Biden is the legitimate president?

I believe September 24, 2021 is a good 9 months after December 13, 2020

Do you just tune out all the news you don't agree with or just forget it?

/republicans-resist-saying-3-simple-210101171.html


Why is it so hard to just say Joe won?

www.donaldjtrump.com/news/news-7sdb8vwjbv0

You really got no leg to stand on after the total ruckus put on by your pals since 2016..........that bar just keeps getting lowered.

We broke into the white house & tried to remove Trump from office?
We entered the White House intent on shooting the President?
We did this to Congress intending to shoot McConnell?

[merh]

https:crime/alleged-insurrectionist-from-colorado-wants-out-of-jail-to-get-away-from-other-accused-insurrectionists/ar-AARDlYH

Alleged insurrectionist from Colorado wants out of jail to get away from other accused insurrectionists
A Coloradan accused of violence during the insurrection at the U.S. Capitol has asked to be released from jail to distance himself from other accused insurrectionists.

Robert Gieswein, of Woodland Park, petitioned the court in the week before Thanksgiving asking for reconsideration of his status before trial. Court documents say Gieswein and others arrested after the events on Jan. 6 are "vulnerable to radicalization" by remaining together.

"...Mr. Gieswein, a very young man who came to the District alone, is now trapped in a highly charged environment that could potentially exert undue influence on his thinking, and may eventually create pressure on him to conform, or to allow others’ political narratives to drive his thinking and decision-making," his lawyers said.

In a handwritten letter to the judge, Gieswein himself said he would like to be released to live with his godparents to help his family financially and separate himself from the environment.

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"That fact is that January 6 was one crazy day with many elements, and I will never put myself into a situation like that again," he wrote. "… to spend every day in here like Groundhog's Day … It is natural in this environment for the conversation always to turn to January 6, and for us to look to each other for strength."

Gieswein is accused of attacking police and spraying them with a chemical during the attempted coup that happened as Congress was set to certify the results of the presidential election. He's accused of being one of the first rioters to enter the capitol, dressed in military gear and carrying a baseball bat.

In court documents, Gieswein's attorneys also raised a concern about a prison incident in which inmates allegedly got sick after guards used an irritant spray to subdue another inmate.

"Save me!
I'm being corrupted!"

[merh]

NATIONAL VERIFY
Yes, some felons from the Jan. 6 insurrection can vote but it depends on where they live
In most states, people convicted of a felony are disenfranchised while they are incarcerated but get their voting rights back after finishing their sentences.
Author: Nate Hanson, Mauricio Chamberlin, Brandon Lewis
Published: 3:35 PM MST December 7, 2021
Updated: 3:35 PM MST December 7, 2021
In November 2021, Jacob Chansley – better known as the “QAnon Shaman” – was sentenced to 41 months in prison for his role in the Jan. 6 insurrection at the U.S. Capitol. Chansley pleaded guilty to a felony obstruction charge.

Soon after, VERIFY viewer Kathy emailed to ask if some people convicted of felonies from the insurrection can still vote.


THE QUESTION
Can some felons from the Jan. 6 insurrection still vote?

THE SOURCES
Secretary of state offices for Maine and Vermont
District of Columbia Board of Elections
National Conference of State Legislatures
American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU)
Campaign Legal Center
THE ANSWER
This is true.
Yes, some people convicted of felonies from the Jan. 6 insurrection can still vote, but it depends on what state they live in.


WHAT WE FOUND
The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) estimates nearly 6 million Americans have lost their right to vote because of a criminal conviction.

The right to vote is overseen by both federal and state governments. But only states have rules restricting felons from the ballot box. So, where a person lives ultimately dictates whether their right to vote will be revoked because of a felony conviction.

Maine, Vermont and the District of Columbia do not take away the voting rights of felons, even while they are incarcerated, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures (NCSL). Each jurisdiction confirms felons can vote even while incarcerated (Maine here, Vermont here and District of Columbia here). Puerto Rico residents also have no voting restrictions based on criminal convictions, according to the Campaign Legal Center, a nonprofit watchdog group.

All other 48 states in the U.S. disenfranchise people convicted of felonies while they are in prison.

But the disqualification to vote doesn’t necessarily extend to when a person is released from prison. The NCSL says 37 states restore the voting rights of people convicted of felonies once they are released from prison or after they served their full sentences, including parole and probation.

In the other 11 states, there are more requirements that need to be met before people convicted of felonies can vote again, according to the NCSL. Some states have an additional waiting period after sentence completion and others require additional action, such as a governor’s pardon.


But most states only restrict the voting rights of people convicted of felonies, not misdemeanors.

While Jacob Chansley pleaded guilty to a felony charge connected to the Jan. 6 insurrection, the Campaign Legal Center noted that most of the crimes people have been convicted of in relation to the insurrection have been misdemeanors. That means their voting status is unaffected in most states.

More than 600 people have been charged in District of Columbia federal court for crimes related to the Jan. 6 insurrection, according to the U.S. Department of Justice.

[merh]

www.newsweek.com/who-james-tate-grant-capitol-riot-suspect-faces-jail-over-rifle-found-car-1663125

James Tate Grant, a North Carolina man charged with assaulting police officers during the January 6 Capitol riots, could be placed in pretrial detention after an assault rifle and ammunition were found in his car during a drunk driving arrest.

Justice Department prosecutors on Thursday submitted a request for a federal judge in Washington, D.C. to revoke the pretrial release of 29-year-old Grant, who is awaiting trial over his documented involvement in the Capitol attack.

The rioter was arrested on December 7 by a police officer in Garner, North Carolina who was responding to a report of a suicide threat. Grant was found pulling out of a restaurant's parking area and appeared intoxicated

Grant told the officer about his role in the "January 6th incident" and tried to flee as he was placed under arrest. Prosecutors wrote in court filings that he "dropped to the ground" and said things along the lines of "Just kill me now" and "It's over."

Police found an AR-15 assault rifle, 60 rounds of ammunition, weapon accessories and combat fatigues in Grant's car. Prosecutors wrote Grant's statements are "of such a concerning nature that there is reason to believe he is a danger not only to the community, but also to himself."

The judge did not yet rule on the request. Newsweek has contacted Grant's attorney for comment.

James Tate Grant's charges stemming from his participation in the Capitol riots include assaulting police officers and entering Senate offices.

Following his involvement in the Capitol riots, Grant is charged with—among other things—assaulting, resisting or impeding police officers using a dangerous weapon and inflicting bodily injury, engaging in physical violence on Capitol grounds, and entering Senate offices

According to court documents, Grant was found to have used a metal crowd control barrier to "forcibly assault, resist, oppose, impede, intimidate, and interfere with" police.

Documents filed by the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) stated Grant's acts were captured in an Instagram video of the attack on the Capitol.

The footage showed Grant and Ryan Samsel, a fellow rioter and co-defendant, leading a crowd of Donald Trump supporters past a first barricade towards the second. Grant was dressed in black, his face covered with a skull mask.

Some of the footage in question was reuploaded to YouTube by independent media outlet ABQ RAW. Standing before the metal fence lined with Capitol police officers, Grant can be seen lifting up the barricade and pushing the officers back with it, causing other rioters to join in on the attack. One officer fell onto the steps behind her as a result.

According to the FBI, Grant's act caused another rioter to jump over the fence and attack two Capitol police officers. As police moved to arrest the attacking man, Grant "interfered with their attempts to apprehend the rioter by pulling the rioter back away from the officers."

After another officer attempted to help his colleagues and punched Grant, the rioter got up and tried to "step over the fallen barricade towards the officers." In the footage shared to YouTube, Grant can be seen pulling the rioter away from officers, then attempting to lunge at police over the barricade.

"The officers make a brief attempt to lift the barricade back up, but the rioters, including GRANT, overwhelm the officers and move forward towards the Capitol Building, forcing the officers to retreat from their position," the document read.

Subsequent footage—both from Capitol security cameras and rioters' social media videos—depicted Grant inside the Capitol. Screenshots of an apparent livestream, as well as a selfie taken by Grant himself, proved he also breached the Senate offices.

The Capitol attack and subsequent drunk driving incident were not Grant's only brushes with the law.

The Holly Springs resident was previously arrested for driving while impaired and carrying a concealed weapon in October. Grant was also arrested for breaking or entering a motor vehicle and marijuana possession in May 2018 and obtaining property under false pretense in September 2017.

In September 2014, Grant was arrested twice: once for breaking or entering a motor vehicle, drug possession, and possession of stolen goods; and again the following day for breaking or entering a vehicle

Poor innocent Trump supporter

[abbey1227]

Dec 25, 2021 18:46:12 GMT merh said:

Dec 24, 2021 23:21:27 GMT abbey1227 said:

You really got no leg to stand on after the total ruckus put on by your pals since 2016..........that bar just keeps getting lowered.

We broke into the white house & tried to remove Trump from office?
We entered the White House intent on shooting the President?
We did this to Congress intending to shoot McConnell?

Blacks completely boycotted the Inauguration.

#Resist March. Was that the same as the pink pussy hat parade?

2, not 1, but 2 impeachments.

Continuing 'investigations' by the NYSD

Who was intent on shooting? All those unarmed people?

Please, do us all that favor

[merh]

Dec 25, 2021 21:06:31 GMT abbey1227 said:

Dec 25, 2021 18:46:12 GMT merh said:

We broke into the white house & tried to remove Trump from office?
We entered the White House intent on shooting the President?
We did this to Congress intending to shoot McConnell?

Blacks completely boycotted the Inauguration.

#Resist March. Was that the same as the pink pussy hat parade?

2, not 1, but 2 impeachments.

Continuing 'investigations' by the NYSD

Who was intent on shooting? All those unarmed people?

Please, do us all that favor

Ruckus?

I am sure there were black people there 
A lot of people chose not to go.
How is that a ruckus?

So now people can't protest?
Toss out the first amendment?
DID THEY BREAK INTO CONGRESS OR THE WHITE HOUSE?
People smashed windows & entered Congress on January 6th.

So the founders were wrong to include a way to remove a bad president??
Once elected, we have to keep them?
They can do whatever they want?

Dude, I keep telling you Trump is a con man.
So now law enforcement agencies can't look into criminals?

https:/2020/08/sdny-going-after-trump-thats-how-they-got

SDNY Going After Trump: 'That's How They Got Capone'

Trump either lied to the tax man, lied to the bank, or both. And that's illegal

By Common Dreams — August 4, 2020
Court filings by Manhattan District Attorney Cyrus Vance Jr. on Monday led to renewed speculation that prosecutors in New York have targeted President Donald Trump with a wider probe into possible fraud or other financial crimes than was previously known—demanding eight years of personal as well as business tax documents just weeks after the U.S. Supreme Court ruled a subpoena for such material must be honored.

According to the New York Times, the first news outlet to report the new developments:

The prosecutors did not directly identify the focus of their inquiry but said that "undisputed" news reports last year about Mr. Trump's business practices make it clear that the office had a legal basis for the subpoena.

The reports, including investigations into the president's wealth and an article on the congressional testimony of his former lawyer and fixer, Michael D. Cohen, said that the president may have illegally inflated his net worth and the value of his properties to lenders and insurers. Lawyers for Mr. Trump have said he did nothing wrong.

The clash over the subpoena comes less than a month after the Supreme Court, in a major ruling on the limits of presidential power, cleared the way for Mr. Vance's prosecutors to seek Mr. Trump's financial records.

Maybe running for president was a bad thing for him, allowing things he had done illegally to gain greater scrutiny. 

You can't tell the bank your hotel is worth $1 billion, but then tell the taxman it's worth $1 million.

https:/2021/06/17/politics/capitol-riot-guns-armed-insurrection/index.html

Washington (CNN)The Justice Department on Thursday charged a US Capitol rioter with bringing a handgun onto Capitol grounds -- two days after a hearing where Republican lawmakers downplayed the deadly attack and claimed the pro-Trump rioters were unarmed.

The new charge was filed against Guy Reffitt, a Texan whose case received national attention after his own family members told the FBI that he threatened to kill them if they turned him in.
Prosecutors said in the new indictment that Reffitt carried a "deadly and dangerous weapon," specifically a "semi-automatic handgun," while he was unlawfully on Capitol grounds. He isn't accused of entering the building itself. But it's still against the law to breach the perimeter of the Capitol complex and storm past fences and barricades, which Reffitt was photographed doing

Unarmed

Sure

[abbey1227]

Dec 27, 2021 14:23:02 GMT merh said:

Maybe running for president was a bad thing for him, allowing things he had done illegally to gain greater scrutiny. 

You can't tell the bank your hotel is worth $1 billion, but then tell the taxman it's worth $1 million.

Prosecutors said in the new indictment that Reffitt carried a "deadly and dangerous weapon," specifically a "semi-automatic handgun," while he was unlawfully on Capitol grounds. He isn't accused of entering the building itself. But it's still against the law to breach the perimeter of the Capitol complex and storm past fences and barricades, which Reffitt was photographed doing

Unarmed
Sure

Running wasn't the problem. Winning was his big mistake.........otherwise these people would be fine today still taking money from him.

Sure you can. In fact, the banks do it all the time in order to make more loans.

I am shocked they even included that fact that he didn't even enter.

[merh]

Dec 27, 2021 15:04:40 GMT abbey1227 said:

Dec 27, 2021 14:23:02 GMT merh said:

Maybe running for president was a bad thing for him, allowing things he had done illegally to gain greater scrutiny. 

You can't tell the bank your hotel is worth $1 billion, but then tell the taxman it's worth $1 million.

Unarmed
Sure

Running wasn't the problem. Winning was his big mistake.........otherwise these people would be fine today still taking money from him.

Sure you can. In fact, the banks do it all the time in order to make more loans.

I am shocked they even included that fact that he didn't even enter.

Banks might do it, but the taxman cares.

Al Capone went away on taxes. Remember?

Gun possession in DC is regulated.
The people who took guns there knew this.

[abbey1227]

Dec 28, 2021 12:37:48 GMT merh said:

Dec 27, 2021 15:04:40 GMT abbey1227 said:

Running wasn't the problem. Winning was his big mistake.........otherwise these people would be fine today still taking money from him.

Sure you can. In fact, the banks do it all the time in order to make more loans.

I am shocked they even included that fact that he didn't even enter.

Banks might do it, but the taxman cares.

Al Capone went away on taxes. Remember?

Gun possession in DC is regulated.
The people who took guns there knew this.

You mean the weaponized IRS? They care so much they hand out $Billions in fraudulent claims. Yeah, I'm convinced they care deeply. 

He did. They couldn't figure out how to get him on his violent crimes..........soooooooooooo

Yep. The nation's Capitol is one of the most infringiest places in the country. Ain't it grande? And it worked so well for them, they had to change the name of their NBA team.

[merh]

[abbey1227]

Jan 3, 2022 1:43:27 GMT merh said:

I'm kinda shocked they haven't formed an official govt party yet.

With all of their empty promises, they'd be sure to attract a crowd.

[merh]

Jan 3, 2022 3:00:28 GMT abbey1227 said:

Jan 3, 2022 1:43:27 GMT merh said:

I'm kinda shocked they haven't formed an official govt party yet.

With all of their empty promises, they'd be sure to attract a crowd.

One of the 3 guys suspected of being Q is running for office in Arizona. 

[merh]

Washington Post
Since Jan. 6, the pro-Trump internet has descended into infighting over money and followers
Drew Harwell, (c) 2022, The Washington Post
Mon, January 3, 2022, 5:04 AM·
In this article:


The far-right firebrands and conspiracy theorists of the pro-Trump internet have a new enemy: each other.

QAnon devotees are livid at their former hero Michael Flynn for accurately calling their jumbled credo "total nonsense." Donald Trump superfans have voiced a sense of betrayal because the former president, booed for getting a coronavirus immunization booster, has become a "vaccine salesman." And attorney Lin Wood seems mad at pretty much everyone, including former allies on the scattered "elite strike-force team" investigating nonexistent mass voter fraud.

After months of failing to disprove the reality of Trump's 2020 presidential election loss, some of the internet's most popular right-wing provocateurs are grappling with the pressures of restless audiences, saturated markets, ongoing investigations and millions of dollars in legal bills.

The result is a chaotic melodrama, playing out via secretly recorded phone calls, personal attacks in podcasts, and a seemingly endless stream of posts on Twitter, Gab and Telegram calling their rivals Satanists, communists, pedophiles or "pay-triots" - money-grubbing grifters exploiting the cause.

The infighting reflects the diminishing financial rewards for the merchants of right-wing disinformation, whose battles center not on policy or doctrine but on the treasures of online fame: viewer donations and subscriptions; paid appearances at rallies and conferences; and crowds of followers to buy their books and merchandise.

But it also reflects a broader confusion in the year since QAnon's faceless nonsense-peddler, Q, went mysteriously silent.

Without Q's cryptic messages, influencers who once hung on Q's every "drop" have started fighting to "grab the throne to become the new point person for the movement," said Sara Aniano, a Monmouth University graduate student of communication studying far-right rhetoric and conspiracy theories on social media.

"In the absence of a president like Trump and in the absence of a figure like Q, there's this void where nobody knows who to follow," Aniano said. "At one point it seemed like Q was gospel. Now there's a million different bibles, and no one knows which one is most accurate."

The cage match kicked off late in November when Kyle Rittenhouse, acquitted of all charges after fatally shooting two men at a protest last year in Kenosha, Wis., told Fox News host Tucker Carlson that his former attorneys, including Wood, had exploited his jail time to boost their fundraising "for their own benefit, not trying to set me free."

Wood has since snapped back at his 18-year-old former client, wondering aloud in recent messages on the chat service Telegram: Could his life be "literally under the supervision and control of a 'director?' Whoever 'Kyle' is, pray for him."

The feud carved a major rift between Wood and his former compatriots in the pro-Trump "stop the steal" campaign, with an embattled Wood attacking Rittenhouse supporters including Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene, R-Ga.; Flynn, a former national security adviser to Trump; Sidney Powell, Flynn's attorney; and Patrick Byrne, the Overstock founder who became a major "stop the steal" financier.

Each faction has accused the opposing side of betraying the pro-Trump cause or misusing the millions of dollars in funds that have gone to groups such as Powell's Defending the Republic.

Wood has posted recordings of his phone calls with Byrne, who can be heard saying that Wood is "a little kooky," and Flynn, a QAnon icon who can be heard telling Wood that QAnon's mix of extremist conspiracy theories was actually bogus "nonsense" or a "CIA operation."

Beyond the infighting, both sides are also staring down the potential for major financial damage in court. A federal judge last month ordered Wood and Powell to pay roughly $175,000 in legal fees for their "historic and profound abuse of the judicial process" in suing to overturn the 2020 presidential election. And Powell and others face potentially billions of dollars in damages as a result of defamation lawsuits filed by Dominion Voting Systems, which they falsely accused of helping to rig the 2020 race.

To help cover their legal bills, the factions have set up online merchandise shops targeting their most loyal followers. Fans of Powell's bogus conspiracy theory can, for instance, buy a four-pack set of "Release the Kraken: Defending the Republic" drink tumblers from her website for $80. On Flynn's newly launched website, fans can buy "General Flynn: #FightLikeAFlynn" women's racerback tank tops for $30. And Wood's online store sells $64.99 "#FightBack" unisex hoodies; the fleece, a listing says, feels like "wearing a soft, fluffy cloud."

Their arguments increasingly resemble the performative clashes of pro wrestling, said Mike Rothschild, a conspiracy theory researcher and author of a book on QAnon: full of flashy, marketable story lines of heroes conquering their enemies. The drama, he said, gives the influencers a way to keep their audiences angry and engaged while also offering them a chance to prove their loyalty by buying stuff.

QAnon is "the easiest money that you could possibly make if you don't have a conscience, but there's only a certain number of people you can fleece. It's not a renewable resource," said Rothschild (who has no relation to the famous banking family targeted in antisemitic conspiracy theories).

"The fact that they're all mad at each other, that's all a byproduct of the fact that they're just desperate for money, and there's only a certain amount," he added. So now, he said, the us-vs.-them argument for many QAnon influencers is: "They're the pedophiles, the Freemasons, the illuminati. I'm the truth-teller. I'm the one who's trying to save the world."

Although Trump is only indirectly connected to some of the increasingly personal battles, many of them show clear signs of his playbook: winning attention and overwhelming the enemy through constant, uninhibited attacks. And the animosity has begun filtering down to mid-level influencers with smaller followings, who have become divided on the basis of their loyalty to the warring camps. Some have begun marking their allegiances on Telegram with special emoji in their usernames: Three stars, for instance, means you're on team Flynn. (His opponents haven't agreed on a symbol yet, though some have used the three stars as a punchline.)

QAnon's credibility didn't exactly climb when its long-heralded promise - that Trump's long-secret war against a Satan-worshiping "deep state" would culminate in a righteous apocalyptic battle known as the "storm" - collapsed last January. As Joe Biden entered the White House, Trump took refuge in Palm Beach, Fla., and most of Trump's enemies were left unvanquished.

Many believers have sought since then to distance themselves from the QAnon name, which they've called a "moniker created by [them] to attack us," though Q is still their central prophet, devotees still call themselves "anons" and the theories remain the same.

Fans of Flynn have argued that, in his caught-on-tape conversation, he was merely disavowing the QAnon media creation, not them, leaving the sanctity of Q intact. On Telegram last month, Wood said that while "Q speaks truth" in the fight against "pedophilia and satanic rituals," the broader QAnon movement is "likely a Deep State operation."

But the movement has far from evaporated. Dozens of candidates who have boosted QAnon talking points are running for Congress this year, including Ron Watkins, the longtime administrator of Q's favorite message board, 8kun, (who, as one unproven theory argues, was perhaps once even Q himself.) And Q-inspired offshoots are promoting anti-vaccine propaganda and other bizarre theories: One group in Dallas has camped out for weeks awaiting the second coming of President John F. Kennedy's long-dead son.

The power vacuum has played out as Trump and his allies have fought not only an investigation into pro-Trump rioters' storming of the U.S. Capitol but separate inquiries into his family business. And Trump himself has had to go on defense. After he promoted coronavirus vaccines as having "saved tens of millions of lives worldwide," some of his most ardently supportive online communities pushed to brand him a traitor.

In an anonymous poll posted to QAnon-boosting Telegram channels asking whether Trump's receipt of a booster shot made them comfortable getting vaccinated, 97 percent of the more than 19,000 votes said no. Andrew Torba, the head of Gab, a social network popular with the far right, posted that Trump's promotion of "his biggest 'accomplishment,' the death jab," was "so cringe."

With Facebook and Twitter banning many Q-related accounts, much of the QAnon discussion has played out in the past year on social media platforms popular with far-right sympathizers. But even those online communities have found themselves in conflict with one another.

In posts to his 3 million Gab followers, Torba has criticized Gettr, launched by Trump's longtime aide Jason Miller, and Rumble, which Torba said was run by "Canadian blockheads" pushing "the establishment right's second subversion attempt of the true alternative tech movement."

Torba has also shared clips of conspiracy theorist Alex Jones saying he would "declare war" on Trump over his support for vaccines. Jones - facing his own financial pressures after a judge ruled in November that he must pay damages to families of children killed in the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting, which he falsely called a hoax - has recently started hawking a membership-only video series for "navigating the apocalypse" for $222.75.

Even beyond QAnon, many in Trump's orbit appear eager to settle scores and wage long-running feuds. Trump confidant Roger Stone, pardoned by Trump after his 2019 conviction on a charge of lying to Congress, invoked his Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination on Dec. 17 after being subpoenaed as part of the House probe into the Jan. 6 riot.

But two days later, on Telegram, he claimed that former Trump adviser Stephen Bannon - an old foe he accused of lying about him during the 2019 trial - "gave the order to breach" the Capitol "to curry favor" with an uninterested Trump. (In his next post, Stone advertised his online fundraising auction, in which he's offering autographed rocks for $50.)

The cage match, coupled with months of pro-Trump prophecies falling apart, appears to have worn down some QAnon promoters. One influencer who recently voiced some exasperation with the "annoying" Wood-vs.-Flynn drama, "SQvage DQwg," said he was considering leaving Telegram and his roughly 50,000 followers "if nothing happens publicly before the end of this year. The time is now. We are tired. Exhausted. Hold the Line doesn't have the same meaning anymore."

But many of the fights still show the tried-and-true signatures of modern-media storytelling: the bitter rivalries and gossip that online audiences often can't help watching.

"It's become almost like reality TV, and what makes great reality TV is conflict," Aniano said. "Conflict creates great content. And these people are content creators, if nothing else."